Is it me or does MOTU`s Tech Really....

[Ernest828]

Suck?!

I have been a MOTU user for about a year and a half now and my experience with their TECH department has been one of complete frustration. I am not looking to start trouble here but I feel we as the users should have our own forum on their website and I know we all deserve a better TECH department for our hard earned cash. I would like to gather as many MOTU users as possible to write our own collective letter with our signatures signed to it demanding the following:

1.) A toll free number

2.) An answering service where we can leave messages and have them call us as oppossed to their current setup where we have to call and hope not tog et a busy signal. (This never happens)

3.) Much more Knowledgebale TECH personel than what they presently have.

Their excuse is always ... "We are going through some growing pains." I am so fed up with this and their lack of respect for their customers. They need to get on the ball and give us what we have become accustomed to from companies such as Sweewater and Mackie... Great products, Great Advice and Great Tech Support (what A Concept!).

Peace,
Ernest

[Nimbus]

Motu, while they have truly wonderful equipment, and were prescient in banking their products on the evolution of the personal computer, failed to invest much of anything in the way of tech support. I feel sorry for the few employees who do answer the phone there, because the person calling has been frustratated for so long getting a busy signal, that they already need a short leash. I won't detail my specific problems with them, but they have fallen way short of treating their customers with a modicum of respect. After all, we have invested (at least I have) thousands of dollars on Motu products which are complicated in that they do many things, and often as not do those many things well. But, if there is a sniggly problem which demands a thorough knowledge of both product and end user system, your much better off calling Sweetwater first, because those people care and they have the smarts. I get the impression that their tech people are overworked, overwrought, and need to get you off the phone. Email is not much better.

I love this company and what I can do with their products and my Mac, and have to say most of the time I've had great success doing what I need to do. But, the caveat was that I had to pull myself up by my own bootstraps most of the time, or call people like Sweetwater Tech.

I hope they invest some dollars in the people factor soon.

[AcousticPro]

I think there is a giant contradiction amongst the public and I'm as much a contributor sometimes as anyone. We expect the world not for nothing, but for very little. We forget that manufacturers are just that, manufacturers. The advent of technical support and the paradigm that should be "free" when you buy a product is fairly recent and mostly the result of the complexity of computer technology and the lack of familiarity of the technology by so many consumers. How often is tech support really an "I can't understand what to do" issue. Not that this type of question isn't valid and has a VERY appropriate place, but would you expect someone from the car dealership to walk you through all the new features of your navigation system in your new car? Audio production technology has practically completely reinvented itself in the last few years. A whole new world of terms and concepts and a new generation of equipment. Sweetwater Sales Engineers step up to the plate daily and sometimes hourly to educate people on how the equipment works and integrates and people appear to value that type of service, but are unwilling to pay for it! It costs dollars to hire more tech support people. Which comes first, the chicken (tech support) or the egg(the dollars) without the dollars you have no tech (they don't work for free) and without the tech you have upset customers. People are unwilling to spend the dollars unless it exists and so are manufacturers, it's a risk, it's overhead, it's business. The dollars you spend on tech are dollars you can't put into other things like development or more inventory. UNLESS... people are willing to pay more once it exists. I here a lot of people complaining about prices on this type of gear from companies like MOTU. They bring their prices down and have to lay off some techs and people complain about that. Where is the win for both parties? Fair prices (sometimes more than you'd like) and Great Service. Any thoughts?

[Nimbus]

A valid point; it is business, and companys doing business need to ascertain the symbiotic relationship among their various departments that result in a successful company. I, for one, feel that Motu has always had very fair and even attractive pricing for their product line. And, truly, I am a manual reader, and don't expect Motu Tech support or any other high tech support company to walk me through how the product operates, after all, I'm sure every company can save a lot of calls with a well written, thorough manual.

It is in that manual that they often tell us that if something isn't working as described and all the suggested troubleshooting efforts have been made to call tech support. It is here where the rubber really meets the road, when something isn't functioning properly. Yes, your point is well taken. Our expectations are perhaps too high, but this phone call to tech support is often one of last resort and, as you probably know there is often a real wealth of information and hidden tips about a product that is not in any manual, and is privy to those who know the guts of the product inside and out and work with it day to day.

I suspect that tech support probably gets more calls than I can imagine from people who don't read or cannot understand the manual or the product. Unfortunately, this irritation must be balanced with the calls from professional users who do know a bit about what theyre doing and need genuine assistance.

I'll back off from my seeming damnation of Motu tech support given your insight, I do appreciate the issue you have raised. However, if tech support has become a way of life and a company perceives their better interests are served by staffing one, then Motu has got to visit this issue within the larger picture of customer satisfaction.

[Ernest828]

There`s often this misconception with professional audio engineers that professionals don`t have to call any TECH because if they`re professional... they should know know how to deal with a problem. With that siad, Yes I agree there are consumers that do not read manuals. I too am a "Manual Reader" and (I admit) I actually enjoy reading them BUT... When I do call Tech Support it is only after I have spent a considerable amount of time trying to understand what it says in the manual. I then go online and try to find a forum or start one. Only after all this has failed to reap the results I need, then do I call TECH.

What really bothers me is the fact that I have spent a load of cash on gear as most studio owners have and when it comes to compressors and mic tecniques, there really isn`t much use for Tech Support from these sorts of manufacturers. However, when it comes to Digital Consoles, Sequencers and other sort of software, ther is a need for TECH SUPPORT. Your point is valid that most problems are consumer related (no experience with computers) yet I completely relate to this because if it weren`t for the continuous education I serve up for myself I too would be lost. Computers are new to all of us in the music industry and I think it is completely unfair for the audio professional SOFTWARE manufacturer to just sell a product and leave you in the dark. This is exaclty how many feel when it comes to MOTU.

When I invest thousands of dollars in a company, I don`t care if its a car, audio sequencer or mixer, I demand quality gear, service and yes,TECH SUPPORT.

MOTU continues to grow and reap in all the cash and yet they do not address the ever growing publics need for TECH support. There is no reason for this. I would be willing to pay more for MOTU gear if I knew I was going to get quality tech support like I do from Sweetwater an MACKIE.

I truly enjoy using MOTU gear and am amazed how much it does for so little cash but throw me a bone.

Peace,
Ernest

[Nimbus]

Ernest828 speaks much truth.

[AcousticPro]

I absolutely agree that if you are willing to pay more if it's necessary to maintain the type of support you REQUIRE in the professional world and the company that is selling the product fails to raise the price if it's necessary then you have every right to complain. Sweetwater has time and time again proven that it is more expensive to provide technical support that works and will continue to do so as long as people keep supporting it with their dollars. I rarely contacted any manufacturers after becoming a Sweetwater customer many years ago. There was no reason to. Sweetwater not only had a tremendous relationship and respect for me, but also with the manufacturers and yielded a much heavier hammer to help me even when I did need something from a manufacturer. As a professional you rely on this type of support to keep you making money. There is NO dollar figure that be placed on support.

[Ernest828]

Acoustic Pro,

I whole heartedly agree with you and if it weren`t for Sweetwater, I would have purchased another sequencer / DAW a long time ago. My first attempts to try and contact MOTU TECH SUPPORT were met with disbelief. The concept that their Tech Support was that bad was mind boggling. Since then I have contacted Sweetwater.

The service and support is impeccable.

I reached "the higher ups" at MOTU with phone calls, really "over the top" emails (I`m embarrassed to say just how rude and obnoxious I got) but I was so angry and frustrated. The best part is that nothing has changed even though they said, "We`re working on it."

It is my hope that we can enough threads on this forum to make a statement and maybe someone can get MOTUs attention and say, "Hey, you guys better check this out."

Until then... Long Love Sweetwater!

Peace,
Ernest

[Nimbus]

Ernest,

Well, a guy named Flavio Gaete at MOTU customer service just made my day, and in this instance, at least, I am dutifully prompted by my conscience to report that this guy really delivered on all the aspects about Motu's support that had been reported here (by me) to be sadly lacking.

I had reported to him an audio noise problem that after some tests suggested by him seemed to indicated a faulty PCI card. I sent my card in and in TWO DAYS had a new card back-brand spankin new. But, the problem persisted even with the new card. I emailed Flavio thinking that it would just go into the long list of emails MOTU had to return and thought it would be weeks. Instead I got a prompt query back from Flavio via email outlining some tests, but not content with that evidently, he called me first thing the next morning and walked me through a rigorous series of tests. He was polite, patient, and thorough. I was pleasantly shocked and wondered to myself whether Motu was planning on getting more people like him.

I'll just leave all of this at face value. The result in this instance was a satisfied customer.

[AcousticPro]

More reinforcement that you don't buy gear, you buy support and service?

[Nimbus]

Jeff,

Of course, I buy both; and, yes, I expect products to perform as advertised and be supported when they don't. And, yes, I do indirectly pay for support and service and I assume that any intelligent company needs to factor in the cost of tech support in proportion to the complexity of the product they are selling, particularly when said product is at the heart of a system involving many other diverse manufacturers attaching to the chain. I've seen and done business plans that factor in everything to arrive at the cost of the product or service. If you wish to succeed in the high-tech audio environment a great product and great service brings repeat business. I'm sure companies can do the math.

C. Michael O'Connell

[AcousticPro]

I agree except on the concept that it's indirect that you pay for support. It's much more direct that you get what you pay for and pay for what you get. It really boils to down to the issue of perception. Someone creates a reality by forming a perception. I'm glad to see that you are open to that perception being changed by giving MOTU some credit when they meet the perception/expectation they have set for you. I am sure companies can do the projected math as well. My comment was more directed at the fact that behind all this "high technology" are people. Nothing happens without people. Any additional thoughts are welcome.

[AcousticPro]

More reinforcement that you don't buy gear, you buy support and service?

[Nimbus]

Jeff,
Sure, I'll buy that last part, and like Ernest I wouldn't mind paying a little more for a device if it helped maintain a good tech support line for both myself and other users of a company's product.

I'm sure Chuck has factored in the cost of Sweetwater's excellent tech support (that really goes beyond both perception and expectations at times) when he figures his cost and volume business projections.

Michael

[AcousticPro]

You are somewhat correct. He leaves the ability to factor that cost in the hands of the sales engineers. So the next time you hear someone complaining the Sweetwater price is a little higher, just read the above thread and you'll know why.

[Ernest828]

Nimbus,

I am truly glad to hear that there is someone at MOTU who cares. This is encouraging. However, this has never happened to me and maybe soon it will. Yet from past experiences, I will continue to call Sweetwater first. I do not have the time or patience to sit on the phone all morning trying to get through to MOTU.

Just to give you a little taste of my MOTU experiences:
Two weeks ago, I emailed MOTU Tech Support with a question, it took them two weeks to get back to me.

I called MOTU several weeks before this and asked them for any suggestions they may have for an external hard drive. The TECH says to me, "I am not free to offer up such information." When I asked him what MOTU recommends for their products, he says, "They do not believe in offering any such info because if you are unhappy with your purchase then you will blame us."

I had to explain to him that I wanted MOTUs opinion in what they feel is the best company to go along with their products. The TECH could not answer the question because he later admitted, he had no experience with any of the Hard Drive Products I was mentioning. Instead of just saying this in the first place and saving me some time and energy, he was avoiding the question and made himself look foolish minutes later.

Now, maybe I am being too hard on him but what is the one Hard Drive company that MOTU is advertising like crazy in all the trade mags? "Its the perfect match for your MOTU rig..." The ANSWER = GLYPH.

You probably all know this but why didn`t the TECHIE? Shouldn`t he know how much his company is promoting GLYPH products??? This seems to be a sincere lack of knowledge on the TECHs part.

Like I said in my first post, I am not here to start trouble but I am here to share my experiences, info, opinions and hopefully to gather enough people to so we can get MOTUs attention and get them on the ball. Out of respect for this TECH I will not mention his name but this is a tremendously frustrating and discouraging sign of the MOTU product.

As the saying goes, "Your only as strong as your weakest link."

Not very encouraging now, is it?

Ernest

[Nimbus]

Ernest

Your experience sounds very familiar. I agree that you can almost never get through to Motu; I got lucky on my first call the last time- must of had the right MOTU MOJO. At any rate my recent experience was a pleasant shock, given all my previous experiences and those like yours. Let's hope this is a new upward trend for Motu.

Nimbus

[mchimes]

Hey,

Just thought I would chime in. I have had an 828 and DP3 for about 6 mos. and have encountered some problems. Some of them were definately my fault (DAW's are new to me), but I also had what I believed to be a defective 828. I called Sweetwater (who I purchased the gear from) and talked to a receptionist who took down my name and told me a SW tech would call me back- which they did- the next day.

The minute I hung the phone up w/ her I called MOTU and of course it was busy. So I hit redial and got into the rhythm of that for about 4 min. It was kind of reminiscent of registering for classes in college. I have done this on 3 or 4 occassions w/ MOTU and everytime I'm talking to someone within 5 min. Sure its annoying- but it worked for me.

So after describing the problem, we determined that the 828 was defective. The tech told me to fax them my receipt, serial #, and mail it. I included a note explaining that I couldn't work until I got another unit . . . so would they please hurry. I mailed on a Mon. and was shocked (after reading so many slams of MOTU support on various forums) to get a brand new 828 on Wed.

That strikes me as pretty good service.

I know I had to hit redial for a few minutes, but a little persistence and patience (The last thing we have when gear is malfunctioning!) can go a long way. To put it in perspective, how long do you wait:

- in line at the grocery store?
- on hold w/ a credit card issuer?
- to talk to some one at Home Depot about whatever?
- for SW to return your call?

Conclusion . . . my experience with MOTU has been average to above average. Just some thoughts. Good luck in the future.

Mike

[rigboone]

Jeff-
so what you're basically saying is because MOTU's stuff is so affordably priced and their profit margins are low the end user should tolerate poor to non-existent tech support? That's the "catalog store" mentality...boo. I love Sweetwater and I know you guys are closely aligned with MOTU, but what about the users who didn't buy from you? A busy signal from the support line indicates "small-time" to me-at least get an answering machine. Some newbie who just dropped $700 on an 828-calls MOTU support and gets a BUSY signal-what impression of the company do you think they have? That they're really busy? What if I called Sweetwater and got a busy signal-I'd call another store,right? I'm a full-time post production engineer who uses ProTools as my main system-I RARELY have had to make a support call within the past 3 years or so-most people who use something all day every day figure out all the quirks and bugs of a system because you have to-you have to keep it running to make money. You might be using a bulldoser, or a Mac running Digital Performer...whatever-you figure out how to fix it. But when I have needed to call Digidesign support-it costs $3 a minute-and you get an agent in about 30 seconds who knows EXACTLY what he's talking about-top of the line. They know your setup from your reg info and your call history-and if they can't help, they don't charge you for the call. That's service-your company has the same support ethic and level of customer awareness. Maybe that's what MOTU needs-a premium support staff providing a fee-based service. Hell, you guys could subcontract it...you get more calls then they do!
Bottom line-Great products-sucky support. Everyone who owns any MOTU stuff knows this is true. I have many clients who echo this opinion.
That's why I use Logic.

[Ernest828]

Well said Rig.

Sing Alleluia!

Peace,
Ernest

[lang_dave]

I would pay for tech support if they could make the PCI324 card work properly in my system.

I call only after I've tried everything else.

I would even pay for a list of certified motherboards / videocards that MOTU would guarantee to work.

But I don't like paying for something that doesn't work and no one really knows how to make it work. That's a drag.....

Wonderful product, but no good to me sitting in the rack collecting dust.

dave

[sajrobb]

Time is money, not only for MOTU, but also their customers. The issue is value. If you spend your time reading, then re-reading, debugging, and then waiting on answers to fix problems, you are not recording, enjoying, and creating with that time. I don't depend on recording to pay my bills, but it appears that those who do, tend to use Pro-tools, because they can keep it working more consistently. Support is vital, even for those who are in this just for the love of music. MOTU needs to work on the value side of their business, starting with the quality of their manuals and their web support. I believe most users would gladly pay for high quality tech support, rather than spend countless wasted hours (hence money) trying to make things work. I applaud MOTU for making a technically challenging product at a low cost, but they need to seriously address the needs of their user community in maintaining value after sale.

[Ernest828]

In all fairness, I am very happy with the User Manual for DP 3. They finally put everything into one attractive and sturdy book. As for Tech support, I`m crossing my fingers.

Peace,
Ernest